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Podcast

Affirmations, Rejection, and the End of ‘Plus Size’: 12 Things We Learned from our Podcast with Ashley Graham

Dolce and Gabbana. Prabal Gurung. Michael Kors. There are many labels Ashley Graham has worn in her life, but for the supermodel and mother of one, there’s one label, in particular,​ she’s ready to do away with for good: ‘plus size’...

“I just think, first of all, we shouldn't be labeling women because of a number inside of their pants”, supermodel Ashley Graham tells host Georgie Abay in the season 3 of AllBright’s SISTERHOOD WORKS podcast. "We don't call the skinny models, ‘the skinny models’ or ‘the thin models’”.

So when Australian label  approached Ashley to model their range of size 10-22 pieces, it was a no-brainer. “They don't use outdated language. This isn't for a curve girl, or a plus size girl, or whatever. They just say, "We're a fashion label." I love that idea. Because I'm all about no labels.”

Although, she laughs, she’s ok with being called a Supermodel.

Prepare to meet your next girl crush as we talk everything from rejection to affirmations, self-doubt, motherhood, and the leather pant she’s obsessed with.

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Ashley Graham wearing Commonry

On her TED talk about affirmations…

It was such an important conversation because I don't think that people were really talking about affirmations six years ago. Now people are talking about them as if it's part of self-care Olympics at this point. I feel like I've had so many ebbs and flows of my life, and my body, and my career. I've had to use different affirmations throughout it all.

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Ashley Graham

On her favourite affirmations...

"I am bold. I am brilliant. I am beautiful." And they really stem from, ‘I am bold’ because I always wanted to be able to speak my mind and speak up for what I believed in, and who I was, and not let the world and the industry tell me who I was. ‘I am brilliant’ is because I was diagnosed with ADD and dyslexia when I was in 4th grade and I had a really low reading level. I was terrible at math. It was also the year that I got glasses and I really had low self-esteem, and I wasn't getting a lot of help from my father. It was tough. So I wanted to always remind myself that I'm brilliant, I'm here for a reason. And ‘I'm beautiful’ because I'm working in an industry that has always picked apart and manipulated my body in such a big way. 

On her mother’s influence...

My mom, she did just such a good job of not comparing herself to anyone or talking badly about herself. She was the epitome of just loving who you are - and not in an overexerting type of way, but like, "I love myself. I love who I am." But she also didn't say that she wanted to change, or she needed to go on a diet, or she hated her double chin. She never said those things. And to have such a balance, I think in this generation, is so important and almost unheard of.

On the term ‘plus size’...

It sucks. I've been modeling now for 21 years and there were many, many curve models before me that were tired of this word, and were trying to get rid of it as well. It's interesting because I'll say to people, "We don't call the skinny models, ‘the skinny models’ or ‘the thin models’. But we call the girls who are over a size eight, plus size." I just think, first of all, we shouldn't be labeling women because of a number inside of their pants, period. And secondly, it shouldn't be like the big girls, oh, they get a label because their hips are bigger, because their gut is bigger, whatever it is. It's just so divisive and men don't do it. They don't really do it in other industries. So I'm sick of it. I don't know what it's going to take to stop it, but I'm on a mission. I've been doing it for 21 years and we've really made some headway.

On self-doubt...

Well self-doubt, and I think imposter syndrome too, can kind of go hand in hand. It's interesting because I've had moments, but I snapped myself out of it because I think "You're supposed to be here. This is what you're supposed to be doing." I give myself a pep talk, and going back to affirmation, it's really about ‘how are you speaking into your life exactly what you want?’ I've been known to record my affirmations or a pep talk conversation into my phone and then listen to it, you know how athletes get ready or a singer gets ready before they go onto stage? And it's kind of like my anthem. And it works because it's your words, it's your voice, and it's from your heart. So I highly recommend doing that.

"I've been known to record my affirmations or a pep talk conversation into my phone and then listen to it, you know how athletes get ready or a singer gets ready before they go onto stage?"

Ashley Graham

On her new collaboration with Australian label Commonry...

They reached out to me and I heard that there was a new Australian label being signed just for curve girls. They don't use outdated language. This isn't for a curve girl, or a plus size girl, or whatever. They just say, "We're a fashion label." It's from size 10 to 22, Australian size. First of all, yes. I love that idea, because I'm all about no labels. So that caught my eye. And then it was the thoughtfully designed, expertly cut, the fit-driven fashion, and they talk about no compromises in sustainability. That also caught my eye.

On her favourite piece from the collection...

I have to say, the leather pant is exceptional. I'm a US size 16. And for me to find a leather pant that fits so seamlessly is a big deal. And it's not like a legging, we're tired of that. I mean, even the Gen Zers said we can't wear leggings any more. They're not a tight leg, they're loose leg.

And I have to say, the vintage girlfriend jean is so good. It's the perfect wash, the perfect leg. It doesn't gap in the back because my waist goes in and my butt pops out. And there's always that gap in the back. This doesn't happen. I'm telling you, the fit is phenomenal.

On the juggle...

This morning I was making eggs and toast and (my son) was screaming on my leg. So I have this backpack carrier and I just popped it on, I'm in a robe, braless, and I've got a baby on my back, in the backpack carrier, and I'm making eggs. I'm like, "I am a ridiculous human, but this is mom life."

On rejection...

It's easy to say, ‘I turn my nos into yeses’. And a lot of people like to say that because I think it's the easy, quick way to do it, especially if you've come out on the other side and you've had success. But I will say that the nos don't feel good and they feel like a big let down. And they also feel like you are unworthy of whatever you're asking for. But for me, my biggest no was when I had just gotten married, so I was probably like around 21 or 22, and I really wanted to design a lingerie line. I had people telling me no left and right. It was like, "No, you're just a model. You're not going to create a lingerie line. Stop thinking outside the box, just focus."

(But) I want to be more than just a model in a magazine. I wasn’t even in magazines, I was just in catalogs. And I tried one more time with a CEO of a company. I said, "I really want to design a lingerie line, would you do it with me?" And she said yes right away. And so I think it's about perseverance and it's about not giving up. Actually, that's how you turn your nos into yeses. It's not a magic wand, but it's about perseverance and patience with yourself.

On her postpartum return to modelling​...

I have to say it felt so right. I got eight months with Isaac, eight months where I didn't leave his side for long. I never spent a day away from him. Eight months that, I don't know many women that have ever had that kind of maternity leave. And it was the silver lining when the pandemic hit last March. I was so ready when I got to Milan, it was like this amazing vacation that I didn't know that I needed, even though I was working every day.

I was still pumping because I wanted to keep my milk supply up. But I was pumping and dumping, I wasn't saving it. So there wasn't the stress of keeping everything so sanitized, and clean, and saving my milk. It was so amazing to be back on the runway. And I was so grateful to walk the Fendi Show and the Etro Show. And just be back in my element, be back doing what I love to do, which is model.

On the women she’s interviewed for her podcast...

Oh my gosh, I've learned so much. Pretty Big Deal is a masterclass for the masses. That's how I always wanted to look at it. I walk into every interview and I ask myself, "What am I going to learn today?" Because I think that, first of all, knowledge is power. And I want to be entertained, but I also want to gain something from everyone that I speak to. Kim Kardashian was so fun because she really just turned into girlfriend vibes and shared so much about her personal life.

Demi Lovato talked to me and she opened up about the difference between body positivity and body acceptance, which was an eye-opening term for me, because I've always said body positivity. And it's been something that's been the core of my brand. And she said, "But I can't have body positivity because I'll be lying to myself every day if I said, 'Thick thighs, you are so beautiful.’ But she does have body acceptance. And what she says is, "Body, thank you for being alive today and thank you for being strong enough to survive today." 

On the values she’s teaching her son...

I want him to know that kindness will get him further than anything in life. And patience, and having a pure heart is very important.